312. Oh, you want me to do THAT! (TJ and Kim Part III)

A bit more background before the “reveal.”  Yes, I can be a tease. 

Kim shared that she knows TJ masturbates and watches porn.  She actually encourages this.   Yet more evidence that she is able to take a “sex-positive” stance regarding others, but is unable to do so for herself. 

 She has tried to watch porn but it reinforces her distorted views that enjoying sex and having your partner enjoy it means you must be open to all things and you must “perform gymnastics in the bedroom” (a phrase she repeatedly uses).   To be clear, I think porn can contribute to a healthy sexual relationship for a couple, and even be healthy for an individual, but if your views on sex are already entrenched in dark and painful thoughts, it is not going to improve your sexual health. 

PORN / BDSMLR
As a quick aside – our own porn viewing habits are such that we typically don’t watch it together.  No need for that as we can put on our own “show” when we are together.  There is some viewing on our own, but mostly it is done in fun.  A “porn sharing game” of sorts that we play.  We like to find things that turn us on and share them with each other.  Sometimes in a strict, “this is just fantasy” way, and other times, “can we try that?,” or, a flirty, “this made me think of you.”   

Our porn habits add to our open sexual dialogue and exploration.  Oh – one thing we started doing lately is using bdsmlr.com as a way to have some fun and explore and share our fantasies and desires.  The three of us share an account and make comments on pics, gifs, or vids that we like.   The comments are sometimes in fun, sometimes reflecting truth, sometimes reflecting fantasy.   Check us out if you are interested.  We are FunsomeThreesome.   That site is a bit “aggressive” if you ask me.  A bit more “ugly” stuff that I’d prefer not to see, but to each their own.  The way we use it is fun for us. 

Back to a regularly scheduled programming. . .

KIM MAKES A REQUEST
Kim told me she had something to ask me.  I recognized her uncomfortable and awkward demeanor as a clear sign it was something related to sex as we had previously had several direct conversations about sex.  I was encouraging her to masturbate and offered to show her in what I joked was either in a “view only” mode or a “hands-on” mode.  She declined.   I thought perhaps she changed her mind.

I admit I also thought perhaps she wants to have sex with me.  She did admit to “playing around” with another woman once.  I am open to it, with Mike’s permission of course.

Then she asked, “Can I watch you and Mike have sex?”

I wasn’t expecting that.

I replied, “I’ll ask Mike.”

She said she wanted to know what I felt.  This led to an interesting discussion about my submission.   So changing gears a bit, here’s how that discussion went.

MY SUBMISSION AND A GODFATHER REFERENCE
I told her my feelings about it are tied to Mike’s feelings.  I want to know his thoughts before making my own conclusions.   She then adeptly asked me, “Forget conclusions, just tell me what you’re thinking.”

I told her I did not feel comfortable sharing my thoughts without first discussing it with Mike.  I explained it is part of my agreement with Mike to respect and support his decisions.  I don’t want to put him in a position of being the “bad guy” by taking a stance that differs from mine.  One way I do that is simply not to take a stance before discussing it with him.

This is actually something that arose from our last contract negotiation – about which I haven’t even written!  I’ll get to a post on that soon.   The short of it is that I need to better demonstrate deference to Mike’s views and decisions.  Sharing my own thoughts and conclusions with others, before sharing it with him, is not consistent with that deference.

I told her, “Ever watch the Godfather?”

“Yeah, TJ loves that movie.”  (Don’t all guys love that movie?  I mean, it’s good, but, men seem to think it’s great.  I think seeing the power the men in the movie have connects to a desire most men can relate to.  It’s basically about a misogynistic culture where certain rules and laws don’t apply to the men.  I digress).

“There’s a scene where Vito Corleone tells Sonny, ‘Don’t ever let someone outside the family know what you’re thinking.’   Well, we’ve adopted that mindset where we both want to present a united front to others.  Big decisions – and I would call this a big decision – require a dialogue with Mike before I share my thoughts with others. 

It’s not that I don’t have a voice.  It’s that my voice is heard by Mike first.  Then based on his conclusions, we form our united front.  That’s how I like it and what I have agreed to with Mike. 

Kim still pressed.  I soon understood that she was very insecure about the question and had a lot of anxiety about not getting any indication as to my feelings.  So I did add something that probably tipped my hand just a little bit – 

“I am happy to help you in any way you want that Mike agrees to.  I am not saying that as an indication that I will obey Mike regardless of my thoughts on this.  I mean, I will obey his wishes, but my reason for saying that is because I want to help you.  In other words, my willingness to help you is because I am willing to help you, and of course, I will obey Mike’s wishes on this or any other way I can help.”

I tempered her thoughts on this being a “done deal.”   Sure, I’ve told her of a lot of our sexploits, but she shouldn’t assume that means Mike agrees to everything.   He is cautious with our “Circle of Trust.”  He doesn’t know her or TJ other than what I’ve shared.  So while I don’t want to guess as to what his decision will be, I know that it isn’t something he considers flippantly.

TJ’S THOUGHTS?
Kim already ran it by TJ.  She told me he was supportive but would want to talk about it with the four of us.  Fair enough.   I’ll ask Mike and if Mike is agreeable, we’ll all talk.

Kim admitted she was feeling tremendous anxiety over this.  The thought that the four of us need to get together to talk through this because of her own hang-ups puts all the focus on her sexual shortcomings.   It’s a lot for her to think about.  She feels very exposed.  In my lingo, she feels extremely vulnerable!   

What a great opportunity to share with her all my thoughts on vulnerability.   I only have a few, hee-hee.  Of my dozen or so posts on this topic, my favorites are Post 30.  I found my Thrill,  Post 67. An Esoteric Ramble and Post 129. Submissive ramble: Vulnerability, Respect, or Love?.  In fact, I think those are my favorite posts of all-time.  They sum up my ideology regarding what it is to really love yourself and others. 

Thus I proceeded to share with her all the wonderful things that come from allowing yourself to be vulnerable.  And she already took the hardest steps.  She had the courage to be vulnerable to TJ in telling him she wanted to ask me that question.   In addition, she was vulnerable to me in actually asking.  And TJ also showed vulnerability in being open to the idea.  There was more to his response than just, “Sure, ask her.”  But I felt it wasn’t relevant to go into detail as overall he was supportive and accepting of the idea.  

MIKES THOUGHTS
I asked Mike.  And his answer?   Next time!  hee-hee.  I am liking these cliffhangers!

NEXT: 313. Contract update – 4 years of DD

311. You want me to do what? (TJ and Kim Part II)

I shared some background about my new friends, TJ and Kim.   My relationship with them has evolved over the past 6-7 months.  While some of this should be in past tense, I write using a current tense as I am sharing it with you for the first time.  I think that makes it easier to follow, no?   Anyway, I babble too much. . .   

I left off stating that Kim began sharing details of her sex life with me.  More to the point, the lack of details.  Kim rarely has sex with TJ, and it’s been that way throughout their marriage.   Yes, they had sex enough to have two kids, so yes, they have sex.  But rarely.
As I learned, it was Kim that had a lot of sexual hangups.  Hangups she openly admitted. 

She grew up being told sex was dirty, naughty, and the only acceptable response to sexual desire was guilt and shame.   So, yeah, there’s that. 

I mentioned that she knew TJ and his ex-wife, Shelagh, even before they were married as they ran around the same circle of friends.   She said she always had a crush on TJ but felt she couldn’t “compete” with Shelagh.  She knew Shelagh well and knew Shelagh to be bisexual, open to threesomes, and basically open to anything sexual.  She wore her sexuality on her sleeve, which was in contrast to Kim, who locked it away buried deep inside her soul. 

Kim had limited sexual experiences before TJ.  She had sex “a few times” with a boyfriend that was fairly serious and they dated for almost six months.  She admits the break up had to do with her reluctance to have sex.   And it wasn’t about “saving herself for marriage.”  She made it clear to the then boyfriend that it was what he should expect from her always.  She even told him, “Sex is something I don’t enjoy.”   

She had a single one-night stand that she “forced herself to do” as she put it.  She just wanted to break out of her sexual shell and thought that might do it.  It didn’t.  It only made her feel worse about herself and about sex in general.   

She even “messed around,” as she called it, once with a woman, but stopped it before they went too far.  She said it was in reaction to trying to “be like Shelagh.”   

She admitted she had this admiration for Shelagh along with a simultaneous feeling of disgust, all wrapped in jealousy as Kim was attracted to TJ.   She always thought of TJ as unattainable and that he wouldn’t ever go for someone “like her.”  She saw Shelagh’s appeal to TJ as being 100% sexual and always imagined they had incredible, crazy, non-stop sex.   Kim said she felt so disconnected because she couldn’t even imagine the word “incredible” and “sex” could go together but just knew that it did for other people. 

Kim also doesn’t masturbate and had a traumatic experience as a child when she was caught touching herself.  It makes me angry to think about it.  She said she was only 8 or 9 and had no clue about what sex was or that it even existed as a thing people did.  She simply noticed one day that it felt good to rub down there.  She said in her mind it was no different than say, the feeling of a good stretch or a cool washcloth on a warm face.  It wasn’t sexual in her innocent mind.  It just felt good. 

To her parents, you’d think she had just strangled a baby.   They were mortified.  She says it took her years to even understand all the terrible things they told her as the thoughts her parents projected were so foreign and over her young head.   While she didn’t understand the meaning, she did understand they were terrible things.  She said her parents said a lot of things, but two words stuck with her.  Even though she didn’t understand what that meant at the time, she understood they were terrible things.  “Pervert.”  “Deviant.” 

Who would call a child such a thing?  And it wasn’t like they just overreacted and let it drop.  For years her parents, especially her mom, would bring up that incident as an example of her abnormal behaviors and thoughts.  

FAST FORWARD TO MARRIAGE
Shelagh and TJ got divorced and Shelagh dropped out of their social circle.  Kim and TJ always talked here and there, but the talks became more frequent and then turned into actual dates with just the two of them and not their group of friends.   Kim said that once it was clear they liked each other and were dating, she knew she would have to force herself to perform all the wild things she had conjured up in her head that TJ and Shelagh must have done. 

Kim said that once they had sex it was obvious to TJ that something was up.  He could tell she was “uncomfortable yet ambitious.”   She vividly remembers those two words because at the time she told herself, “That’s better than pervert and deviant.”   They then had a frank conversation about sex.  She remembers it as one of the most mortifying discussions she ever had.  Here’s this guy she has always had a crush on, who she thinks expects gymnastics in the bedroom.  And here she is, worse than a sexual novice, she was a sexual desert, void of any positive feelings about sex. 

He told her that the sex was not as important to him as simply being around her.  At the time she interpreted as “let’s just be friends” but, to her amazement, quickly realized that no, he still wanted to be dating her.  To be clear, he did tell her that he enjoyed the sex they had, and would enjoy more of it, but that he understood if it was something she didn’t want to do very often.   She said she didn’t have the courage to tell him, “Very often?  How about never?”   

They did have sex here and there but said it was always something “she allowed” TJ to do to her.  It wasn’t something she did to him or that the did together.   How sad. 

Clearly, TJ accepted this.  They got married and had sex enough times to have two kids within four years.   Kim said that at the time, having sex with the prospects of getting pregnant was the first time she had an inkling of enjoyment out of the sex.  She looked at as “sex with a purpose” and that purpose didn’t include feeling the pleasure that was “deviant or perverted.”

Oddly, Kim said that her feelings about sex are compartmentalized as to apply only to her.  She understands others enjoy it and wants others to enjoy it.  She said even thinking of her daughters as sexually active someday doesn’t bother her.   She said she knows Hailey masturbates and even offered to buy her a vibrator (which she said Hailey embarrassingly declined and said, “Mom!  Are you nuts? I don’t want to talk to you about that.”  Kim said she told Hailey there wasn’t any need to talk, but that it was okay and fine if she ever wanted to talk or wanted a vibrator.

To me, it’s incredible to hear that, and other examples she shared of being very sex-positive with her daughter.  I often find the “sins of the parents” are often instilled into their kids who can’t help but project the judgment of their own parents onto their kids.  And while I know it isn’t always like that, rarely is it the opposite extreme of openly rejecting that judgment.   Good for Kim, and if only she could reject that judgment on herself.

TODAY (as in a few months ago)
Kim told me that she and TJ have sex a few times a year.  She does oral on his birthday, and beyond that, it’s just penis-in-vagina sex.  She does let him finger her, but she rarely touches his penis.  She says she thinks she has climaxed a few times but isn’t sure (which to me, means she hasn’t).

She told me she really wishes she could open up sexually, but it just horrifies her.  I suggested counseling but she said that horrifies her even more.   She said she can barely talk about it with TJ, is totally weirded out by talking to me about it, and can’t imagine talking to a stranger.  She said she is only able to overcome her fear and talk to me because I seem so at ease with my sexuality.  (Yes, Kim asked me all sorts of details and I shared them as if sharing a favorite recipe).

Then, one day, she told me she had something to ask me.  I recognized her expression and awkwardness.  I’ve seen it before.  It meant that the topic had something to do with sex.   My mind raced with what it might be as I had been sensing she was wanting something sexually from me.  What she asked me was not the “something” that I was expecting.

Next: 312.  Oh, you want me to do THAT!

310. TJ AND KIM

I left the prior post teeing up some new friends, TJ and Kim.

CONUNDRUM
When I posted more regularly I could share stuff more in real time.  I could reflect and ponder my thoughts and feelings flowing through my mind.  I could share events as they unfolded.

But now I am a lazy-ass who neglects her blog.  By the time I get to write something, it’s well in the past.  Like that prior post regarding Chelsea and Jaime.  Her story is so interesting to me, and one I would have shared in more detail, if not for it being “old news” in my mind.  Thus, I skipped over the details of her story and got right to how it impacted me re Mike is now some sort of Discipline guru for them.

I miss writing through an experience.  Writing always causes a deeper and more meaningful reflection of how I feel about it all.  That’s always fun. . . well, for me anyway, maybe not you.

So here I am again with the same conundrum with TJ and Kim.  I can get right to where we are today, or I can share more of their background.  The interesting thing about them is, well. . . it’s THEM!  It’s their relationship, their circumstances, and their path that led them to my kinky fuckery.   Okay, yes, I hear many of you just say in your head, “That relationship stuff sounds boring, get to the kinky stuff!”   Sorry.  I think I will provide the background this time.

And just to keep some element of suspense here — know the ultimate kink in this relationship was not what I expected.   Okay, that sounds like I go into a friendship expecting some kink.  Let me rephrase – I wasn’t expecting it to lead to anything kinky at all.  But, when it was evident it was pointing in a kinky direction, it wasn’t quite the kink I expected.   With that. . .

TJ AND KIM
I met Kim at a park where I frequently walk my dogs.  She would be there with her three kids, 2 daughters, 14, and 12, and an 8-year-old son.   The kids are homeschooled and the park was where she takes them for some outside activities.  Nature trail, playground, and a great place to do a lesson if the weather cooperates.  

The oldest daughter is TJ’s from a prior marriage and the daughter has always lived with them.   The youngest has some developmental delays and issues.  Thus, we had two things to instantly bonding experiences.   One, being stepmoms that raised their step-child, and two, being moms to a special need child.    

The kids were first attracted to my dogs, which is how I got to know them and know Kim.  Over time we would often sit and talk while the kids played or did school work.  Kim would often bring along their lunch, and before long, I would make some cookies or bake something to surprise them with.   Kim and I began to text each other to more frequently to sync up our park time.   Over about six months I got to know them pretty well and yes, they got to know me and my “alternative” lifestyle. 

DON’T ASK, DON’T TELL   IF ASKED, DO TELL
As you may know, we have adopted an “if asked, do tell” approach to our lifestyle.  Not in the kink and sex stuff sort of way.  Basically, no different than if anyone has asked you if you are married.  You wouldn’t say, “Yes, and we fuck like rabbits.”  Well, okay.  Yes, some of you would you crazy kinkster.

Simply, I say something like “I am in a three adult relationship with me, my husband, and our girlfriend, and I have two grown kids out of the house and one teenager still at home.”   Any more details beyond that are based on their questions with the intent to provide honest information but the minimal amount necessary to answer their question.   Most people don’t ask many questions, at least not at first.

I don’t bring up the discipline, but it tends to come out over time if people are around me long enough.  They see it in my behavior or how I talk about Mike.  Over time, Kim not only came to fully understand my Triad, but the DD and D/s one as well.  Fortunately, it didn’t make her run away from me.  We continued growing our friendship undeterred. 

I GOT A JOB
At some point, Kim shared some of the challenges in homeschooling the eldest, Hailey.  It was pretty clear it was an issue of growing teen-angst peppered with other issues that would be tough on any 14-year-old.   Hailey’s mom and dad were only married about a year, and the dad got custody.  TJ and Kim married when Hailey was just 1 (somewhat like my situation with Mike and T1).   

The mom is remarried to a woman and had only sporadic involvement with Hailey over the years.  That contact has increased recently as her mom now lives closer to them. 

The short of it is one day at the park Hailey was struggling with a lesson.  I helped her “get it” and before you knew it, I became her tutor.  Kim even pays me.   I am not a teacher, but I did start out as pursuing an education degree.  I changed my focus to counseling and education psychology. 

Hailey responds well to me.  I think it reached a point where she didn’t want her mom (Kim) to be her teacher and just wanted her to be a mom.  Yes, Hailey refers to Kim as her mom.

The tutoring gig led me to go to their house and meet Kim’s husband, TJ.   He’s a doctor and they live in an upscale neighborhood with an amazing house.

THEY ALL KNOW
Shortly after I shared bits of my dynamic situation with Kim, to my surprise she shared that information with her kids.  In very basic terms, they knew I shared my husband with another woman, that I was bisexual, and, that I agreed to follow my husband’s rules.

While that sounds like a lot for a kid to process, it really isn’t.  Frankly, the 8-year can’t connect to what the implications of all that really are.  It simply is what it is.  “Oh, it’s like there’s two mom’s in the family,” and “So like your husband is like the boss?”    And that was that as far as he was concerned.  Just facts to know but nothing to judge and no cause for concern.   Only if everyone reacted this way!

The 14 and 12-year old processed it a bit differently.  They both asked their mom if I was gay or bisexual.  She told them something like, “bisexual I guess, you can ask her what she identifies as.”   She said they both shrugged it off but asked her, “Okay, just wondering but what do you think?”

Kim told them something to the effect, “Well, that’s not for me, but there are a lot of things that aren’t for me and a lot of things that are, and what’s important is love and happiness and if someone has that, then good for them, however, they have it.”

I admired how Kim navigated this with her kids and I think the non-judgemental response also helped Hailey in her thoughts about her biological mom.  Also, by reacting in a way that made it feel like a non-issue, it was. . . Surprise!  A non-issue.

As a quick aside – I have found more people react like Kim has than I have found react in a negative, judgemental, or abrasive manner.   Even people that I know strongly disagree with my choices, I do at least get a minimal amount of acceptance.   Ultimately, I don’t care what others think, but it is always nice to find that people can be accepting of something that is clearly not their cup of tea.   I think what has helped my experiences with this is the filters in my life.   I’ve mostly filtered out the toxic people.

MORE ON TJ AND KIM
TJ is 8 years older than Kim.  Oh, Kim is 39, TJ 47, married for 13 years. 
Tj’s ex-wife is 34, having Hailey when she was 20 and TJ was 33.   Kim actually knew TJ’s ex-wife.  They were all in the same circle of friends.  She knew TJ as well.   

As I began to be able to talk more and more privately with Kim. . . lots of texts and calls, and many lunch dates. . . I got to learn more about her personal life.  More specifically, her sex-life, or lack thereof.   And thus began the kinky adventure. 

As I wrote in my last post, I have become like this island for Misfit Kinksters.  People seem to open up to me about sex.  I think that’s part of what happens when you allow yourself to be vulnerable to someone — vulnerable by telling them the truth about who you are and what you feel.   If they don’t outright reject you because they are close-minded, scared, or just otherwise turned off — they instead will reciprocate.  Vulnerability is an amazing thing!  Maybe I should write a post about it.   Oh wait, I already wrote like 20!  Ha.   Yes, vulnerability is my favorite topic.  

So there you have it.  An intro on TJ and Kim.   As to where our relationship has evolved, well, stay tuned!  Lots to write about!  But as I stated at the start, it didn’t go where I thought it might. 

307. Posting Blues

Just a quick note about my decreased posting.

Life is good
Over the past many months I’ve increased my volunteering at an animal rescue and rehab, we’ve sort of re-invented our family evening times, I have an expanded IRL social circle, and I started tutoring an 8th grader.  It has led me to simply deprioritize my internet time.  Not out of any disdain.   Something simply had to give and internet time was it. 

Oh yeah, and I had a niece move in with us for almost a week while she sorted some things out.   That was an interesting experience I can share when I get to it.

So much more to share.  There are TJ and Kim and there are Jaime and Chelsea.  Both couples have interesting stories by themselves, let alone how they entwine with my perverted and twisted world. hee- hee.  

There are interesting updates on the family…well, at least interesting to me.  Maybe that will be a post.  

And we have a new DD contract!  Wow, that certainly should be post-worthy. Not much has changed since our last one, but come on, Jen!  Contract time is usually gold for several posts. . . contemplated changes, the actual changes, reconciling various emotions, reflection, how we are adjusting to those changes.   Damn, that was probably four to six posts I let slip by!    Oh well, I’ll just have to give you the short version someday.  Hey, I heard that.  Who just said, “There’s no such thing as a short version whenever Jen posts.”  Was it you?  I thought so.

And of course, a few interesting punishments here and there, and some new sexy-time intel I can drop on you (we’ve gone to a few “adult” parties).    So yeah, lot’s to share when I can get to it.  

And it’s not all just kink.  We somehow got addicted to the Masked Singer and it became a family ritual to watch it.  It had been a long time since we all got into the same show.  It was a great bonding time and the show was so silly but so fun.  When it ended, we started watching other reality shows, the Voice, American Idol in particular. 

It’s a family ritual now and it’s nice to just sit around the t.v. and experience things together that are light and fluffy.  Sure beats listening to the news and how our country is rotting from the top down while a segment of our society cheers the loss of our democracy and humanity while simultaneously wrapping themselves in the flag while clutching the bible.   Oh, sorry.  I digress.        

The kink is still all there, even cranked it up a bit, and DD life is great!  I hope to post more soon!

Next: Another interesting acquaintance – Chelsea Part I