136. Submitted Wife: Degrading, Unfair, Unhealthy

I can’t go too many posts without writing about my thoughts on submission.  What prompted this one was a discussion with my sisters (See Post 116 re my “coming out” to them).    

By the way, I still refer to my lifestyle as Domestic Discipline, but I recognize it has evolved to be more aligned with a Dominant/submissive lifestyle.  Once you name something, it is hard to change it.  DD is in the name of my blog and I am sticking with it. Oh, back to my sisters…

My sisters continue to ask me a lot of questions and I often am the one soliciting their questions.  I like to hear their thoughts and comments.  I know they will be unfiltered as we have a way of being totally “brutally” honest with each other.  I believe it is because we are all so secure in our sisterly love for each other that we know how to communicate tough issues very well.  We can be critical without condescension, and at no time make each other feel bad.  We share our feelings so that we are better understood and so that we can better understand each other.  So everything we say always has the underpinning of love.

I’ve also shared before (Post 2. The Backstory) that growing up there was a strong sense of “woman empowerment” bestowed on us by our mother.  Being a submissive wife was never in my future as far as my mom was concerned, or my sisters, or even me, until submission found me.  

WHY?
My sisters keep coming back to the same question, “Why?”   It isn’t that they didn’t listen to my answers or that they didn’t believe my answers.  They admit that my answers were touching, heart felt, moving, and well articulated. But still, it’s like, “Can you tell me ‘why’ again?”

The analogy I use is that it is as if they are learning a foreign language and haven’t retained the knowledge to understand it.  And like learning a foreign language, they need repetition.  So I repeat, and I repeat.  I think it is slowly sinking in, but this time I realized I needed to change my approach.    

Understand before being Understood.
I fell back on some of my counseling background and a simple communication axiom of “Seek to understand before being understood.”   In our previous conversation I was providing my sisters with a lot of information, but it was about the things that were important to me, that motivated me, that justified to me why I made the decisions I made.  I finally realized I needed to understand them first.  

I asked them what they thought submission was and what they thought my reasons were.  In those answered, I found the biases that society conditions us with and the loving concerns they had for me because of those preconceived notions.  Thus, I finally understood our conversation needed to be about what D/s WASN’T more than it needed to be about what D/s WAS. 

 In their minds, submission is

• degrading
• unfair
• unhealthy

Their actual list was longer, but I consolidated it into those three themes.

First of all, I agreed with them.  Submission COULD be any or all of those things.  Just like “Love” could spiral into any or all of those things.  The potential for those things should not be dismissed or taken lightly, but the fact is, I believe healthy D/s relations are devoid of those things.  Then we talked about each one.

DEGRADING
In their minds it was degrading to allow myself to be under Mike’s authority.  We then talked about authority in a household setting.  They agreed that in their own relationships there were things that naturally evolved where they defer authority to their husbands, or their husbands to them.  We talked about the process that got them to that point.  That process was full of arguments and conflict and even some lingering resentments that years later could be called to the surface in a moment.  In fact, there were several issues where “authority” was still in dispute and a source of  anger or resentment.  One of my sisters even said, “It still burns me today to think of….”

So I told her, “So, you feel disregarded by your husband about that issue, don’t you?”   She agreed she did.  

“And are there things that you have assumed responsibility for where he may feel disregarded by you?  She agreed that this was very likely the case.

Then I said, let’s look up the definition of what it is when you disregard something that should be taken into account, such as someone’s feelings.  We quickly got to words like contempt and, sure enough, degrade.

To me, the degrading isn’t about the person. She wasn’t degrading her husband, nor he degrading her.  What was being degraded was their happiness and love.  Sure they still loved each other.  The issue didn’t rise to the level that it destroyed their love, but, it still made it less than it could be and provided less peace and fulfillment in their relationship.  To this day, years later, there was lingering resentment.   I told my sister I have absolutely no lingering resentments, nor does Mike.  That’s the power of submission for us.  It allows our love to be the greatest it can be, no pock marks or degradation anywhere. 

One other aspect of “degrading” to them was the notion I was being treated like a child.  Well, I never spanked my kids, nor did my sisters with their kids, so no connection there.  But forget the spanking, yes, Mike is the disciplinarian, much like a parent would be.  I can’t argue that.  His role has some similarities to that of a parent but D/s goes way beyond a parents role in disciplining a child.  Also, I not only fully consent to him being the disciplinarian, but I asked for him to be that.  I’ve found I can better meet my commitments to myself and to him and have greater self control and happiness by submitting to his discipline and deferring to his will.  I don’t find it degrading, I find it uplifting.

I shared with them that accepting his discipline was a journey within our journey.  That is, initially I only accepted it on my terms, explicitly laid out in our contract.  And there would have been nothing wrong with it if it stayed that way, but, I changed and my needs changed.  I wanted more discipline and developed an unquestionable trust in Mike.  To me that is when our dynamic became D/s versus DD.  I am not just subject to his discipline, I am simply and completely “his.”   

UNFAIR
Since we already were looking at definitions, we then took a look at the definition of “unfair.” Basically there are two.  One deals with the principals of justice, the other is in regards to lack of kindness, sensitivity, and thoughtfulness.  It was interesting because one sister was hung up on the principals of justice part of it while the other was hung up on the kindness and thoughtfulness part of it.

Justice, in other words, equality.  D/s isn’t about gender roles. There are D/s relationships where the man is the submissive and there are same-sex D/s relationships.   D/s is not an indictment on women.  It is about the two individuals and what works for them. Gender is something that obviously exists, but doesn’t dictate anything.  Having said that, yes, I’ve observed most D/s relationships have a male Dom.  That simply could be because society has preconditioned too many men such that they would never consider it or would never explore it.  Society more easily accepts a submissive woman. 

I also explained that for me, D/s is about choosing a leader in the relationship.   Granting someone authority to lead you, whether it be a boss, a pastor, a teacher, a doctor, a friend, a spouse, etc., is not a value judgement on someone’s worth.  Allowing yourself to be led is not unjust.  And it is not unjust when I choose to acquiesce to Mike’s leadership, even on things I don’t agree with.

If you do not acquiesce at work, you can be fired.  At church or school?  You can be expelled.  With your doctor?  You can become ill or not get well.  With friends, it is a give and take, and when you give authority to them, you aren’t “less than,” nor when they give you authority are they “less than.”  With spouses, it can be similar to friends, but there is that risk of resentment over time if you feel pressured to acquiesce on things that are important for you to lead.   So let’s agree that leading or following is not a value statement on the person leading or following.  Following doesn’t equate to “less than.”

Then I asked them in situations where both they and their spouse wanted to lead, or neither wanted to, what happened?  Did they feel joy, peace, and composure?   No, they used words like “agitation” and “hostility” to describe how they and their partners feel in those situations.

I asked them if those feelings were really fair?   Is it fair for them to feel hostile towards their loved one, or their loved one towards them?   And again, let’s not look at fairness towards the individual, but fairness towards their love.  They agreed, it was not fair to have their love diminished over such trivial things.  I said I never feel agitation or hostility, nor does Mike towards me.   So how is it that Mike and I are being unfair to each other or unfair to our love?   How is it that a lifestyle that fosters true joy for us ever be considered unfair? 

UNHEALTHY
Other words used were “demoralizing” or “dehumanizing.”  I took on the “dehumanizing” part first.  What is dehumanizing about feeling joy, feeling fulfilled, feeling true bliss?  Is the oneness I have with Mike (Post 30.  I found my Thrill,) dehumanizing?  Just the opposite.  These feelings are the pinnacle of the emotions you want to feel as a human.  How can that be dehumanizing?

As for “demoralizing?”   I am more hopeful than ever regarding my marriage and my life.   I am deeply humbled, but not over some defeat of who I am today, but over the defeat of who I used to be.   I am humbled to where my pride does not blind me or control me.  I am not a doormat.  I simply gave up my ego.  I am ego-less.  I no longer belong to me.  I belong to Mike.   That excites me, motivates me, fulfills me.  Demoralize me?  No.

One last point I made with them was that my motives for being submissive are fully and totally personal.  It is not because of any society expectations, religious beliefs, or, of course, any family expectations.  I state this only to share my motives with you, not to question or belittle those who are motivated by those or other things.  I believe that this is one reason I am so happy with this.  It is absent any outside influence or pressure.  It is of my own making.

As I shared in my first few posts, I was looking for something to provide a more fulfilling life for me, my husband, and family.  I stumbled across DD and made an immediate connection with it, and it has worked for me.  I was extremely fortunate to have a husband who supported it.  Contrary to what people think, I know a lot of men would not have embraced being a Dom.  Just like submission is not for everyone (man or woman), Domination is not for everyone.

After this discussion they seem to be getting it. I am sure there will be more talks before they fully reconcile it in their minds.  Note that in no way am I trying to suggest they should do this or you should adopt this lifestyle.  HOWEVER, I do encourage them, and you, to be more vulnerable to those you love.  That doesn’t mean DD or D/s, unless you feel it should.  And even then, it takes two, and a good Dom is serious about their duties to nourish, respect, and love, as much as a good sub is serious about committing to constant submission that is always there, even when the Dom doesn’t deserve it.  

Just one last thought, also covered in Post 30 but worth repeating, is that achieving oneness with your partner is not about achieving sameness.  As it says in my favorite line from my favorite song ever, “We are one, but not the same.”  (U2’s “One”).    I strongly encourage you to read Post 30.  I found my Thrill, if you haven’t already. 

Peace, joy, love, and fulfillment!

NEXT:  137. Spanked over a new Maintenance Spanking

88. Something true

Infection
My last post left off with my realization that I let jealously and resentment infect some of my interactions with Donna.  I must clarify that those feelings have nothing to do with our unique relationship/arrangements regarding sex and submission.  While those feelings are also at the heart of what I wrote about in Post 80 regarding Kayla – again, I now know that those feelings had nothing to do with the potential path we may go down regarding a deeper and more intimate relationship with her.

These negative feelings are all about my coming to terms with the needs of my son.  I will refer to him as J.  It sure is a lot easier to type “J” every time than saying, “my son,” “our son,” etc.

I’ve shared that J has special needs and likely will not be able to ever be independent.  As he is now 16, we are seeing some signs that he may be able to function in a group home type setting or with some level of autonomy.  My husband and I have talked about at some point perhaps moving and getting a large lot where we could have a second, smaller apartment-sized home on the property where he could live.

Source of my Infection
I discovered a feeling I never recognized or confronted before.  It has probably been there for a long time, but I pushed it down through various means.  Pre-DD is was kept at bay by trying to control and solve every problem of the world.   Now that I have given up being everyone’s problem solver, it took 17 months for this feeling to finally make itself known.  I have resentment over having a special needs child.   This is soooo hard for me to state.  I feel awful and sad for feeling that way.

The trigger that would project this feeling into my interactions with Donna or Kayla is that they are so “free”, and I am not.  Donna is an empty-nester, Kayla is just beginning her adult life.  While I can try to reconcile this by recognizing they both have their own shit to deal with, my shit is, well, shittier.  That’s a dumb way to think, but, well, that’s what I am thinking when the resentment builds.

I definitely don’t project that resentment on J.  He didn’t ask for or cause the issue and he deserves and gets nothing but unconditional and tremendous love from both Mike and me.  I don’t project this resentment on Mike, because he is in the same boat as me and does a great job of helping out with J.   I don’t project it on my sisters or other family members because I feel they have their own set of issues and challenges in life and they still find time to lend me their support and love regarding help with J. So, who does that leave as targets?  Ah – my friends and acquaintances.

Targets of my infection
My circle of close friends is  small.  There are many we socialize with – past and present co-workers of both Mike’s and of mine, old high school and college friends, etc.  But that is mostly casual socialization and not a deep and meaningful friendship.   Pretty much there are three people who I fully confide with that are outside my family.   There is Amy, which I talked about in post 62 and post 64.  She lives in another state.  While we remain close, it is more via email, FB, and the occasional phone call.  Not enough interaction to ever project resentment towards her.  So that leaves only Donna and Kayla.  Donna for sure, and only recently, Kayla.   Yep, they’ve become an easy target towards which I can project my resentment.

Thank you Domestic Discipline
It is totally unfair to them, I know, but it is the reality of it.  I have always been very introspective and always have sought to get to the bottom of my feelings.  However, pre-DD this would have taken longer to identify (actually, it would never have been identified) and once identified, I wouldn’t have shared it with anyone, even Mike.

I must credit DD with “forcing” me to share my feelings (let alone helping lead me to my catharsis per my prior post).    By sharing exactly what I was feeling with Mike, it allowed me to have an empathetic and supportive partner to help address this.  Further, my DD “gave me permission” to then share this with Donna and Kayla.   That sounds silly, because it was something we all have – ability to share our feelings.  But there are often hundreds of reasons we choose not to do so.  My DD basically says there are no reasons to do so and I must share, at least with Mike.  Once shared with him, I found it easy to share with others that I love or have a deep friendship with. Plus, Mike ordered it – although, I took it more as an encouragement, re, “You need to talk to Donna and Kayla about what you are feeling.”

As shared in Post 80, I was able to talk to Kayla at that time and admit I was feeling jealous and resentful.  However, only now, after feeling that way towards Donna, do I realize I had the cause of those feelings wrong.  In that post I attributed it to lack of control over our possible sexual relationship with Kayla.  Yes, I felt relieved to gain that control, but that was only a band-aide and not the cure for the resentment.   Just like pre-DD, “having control” helped bury the resentment, but the resentment was still there.  For years, having control of a situation was just a proxy that fooled myself into believing I was solving for my lack of control over J’s disability.

I like the saying that “emotion comes with an entourage of associates.”   I don’t know if that is a saying anyone else has said or if I created it.  I just know I picked it up at some point. What I mean is that emotions are complex and getting to the root cause can be a challenge.  Even when you think you’ve found it, you may be fooled by one of the “associates” who were disguised or hidden.  I guess that is what keeps psychologists in business.

Anyway, such was the situation with Kayla.  While there is no guarantee I finally got it right, I feel highly sure of myself that indeed the root cause of this is from my feelings about J’s disability.

I’ve now been able to confront this head on by having a conversation with both Donna and Kayla (separately) about my behavior towards them at times.  Just recognizing it and discussing it with those that it impacts does so much to start healing it – it’s amazing.

Something that is true doesn’t always require the truth
I feel foolish for feeling resentment about anything.  I have a wonderful life filled with opportunities and love – probably more than most people.  But, we crave what we crave, we love what we love, and we resent what we resent, whether or not those feelings make sense, because, well, feelings are not logical (just look at our presidential election – hee hee. . . or perhaps not so “hee hee”).

Feelings, while they are true, they don’t require the truth.  There can be unquestionable evidence that tells us we should feel a certain way, yet, those facts are dismissed or entirely missed due to painful feelings that distort our reasoning or simply due to cognitive dissonance. Thus, we continue to hang on to a “truth” that isn’t true (it’s like that with beliefs too).  If what I am stating is untrue, we would all feel the same way about things or believe the same things.  The fact that we do not tells us that logic and  what is “true” does not prevail.  Feelings and beliefs prevail.

That’s where I am right now.   I have lots of reasons (truths) to never feel resentful for my lot in life, yet at times, I let resentment enter.  Ideally I’ll reach a point where it is no longer present, but until then, it is no longer hidden from me.  I can recognize it and look it in the eye and do my best to subdue it.  And because I am able to share this with those that are impacted by it, and those people are loving and caring, they too can help me recognize and subdue it.

Just recognizing all this makes me feel 10 times better and feel more compassion, love, and gratitude for my life and those in my life. Resentment doesn’t stand a chance!

Okay, enough pouring out of my emotions.  Let’s talk about some spankings or some sizzling sexcapades with Donna, or what exactly is going on with us and Kayla!   Maybe next post.

89. Spank Jealousy Away

81. Expectations

Just a quick post about Kayla and then I’ll post something new and sizzling. After five straight posts about her, starting with 76. Meet the Babysitter, it’s time to share other things. . . after this brief message.

Expectations are Premeditated Resentments.
As mentioned in my last post, I feel so much better about the situation. Being more in control of the decision has really opened my mind up to better explore the possibilities. I’ve been clear with Kayla that I need her to share her expectations with us, and we will continue to share ours with her.

It reminds me of one of my favorite sayings,  “Expectations are premeditated resentments.” That is, our expectations set us up for future resentment. In other words, the root of all resentment are the expectations we had that were not fulfilled.  It is akin to what I explored in my post 30. I Found My Thrill.

It may sound like I am beating a dead horse but I am pushing Kayla to search inside herself and understand and articulate her expectations – and Mike and I are doing the same searching. (I wonder how “beating a dead horse” translates internationally? No, it’s not a BDSM euphemism, but it sounds like it could be!).

Bottom line – If expectations are aligned (doesn’t mean they have to be the same, just not in conflict), then we greatly reduce the risk of resentment rearing its ugly head.

Okay, I promise, no Kayla on the next post!

82. Enjoying the Ride

79. Anxiety, Resentment, Jealousy, Guilt

I am very anxious. I need to purge my emotions, so apologize in advance if this becomes a rant. I don’t think I am saying anything I haven’t shared with Mike and Kayla, but perhaps some new or more constructive ways to express my feelings will emerge.  This is a continuation of what I’ve shared in this post and this post, and in this post as well.  Sorry to have to share as the events unfold, but it sure is great therapy to write this.

This whole thing with Kayla has me all out of sorts and I can’t put my mind to just about anything for more than a few seconds without it drifting back to our situation with Kayla. I already talked about the risks that concern me, such as the increased need to practice safe sex, the implications of Kayla being someone who our son is close to, and my motherly instincts being more prevalent when I interact with Kayla and thus makes it harder for my mind to see her in a certain way. In addition, my concern that her neediness may cause problems.

What if we pursued something?
Putting everything aside that I previously stated, the other issues are that if we did pursue a sexual relationship, what exactly would that entail?   F*ck-buddies?  Would she partake as a submissive?  It sure seems to be leaning toward the latter…and submissive to just Mike, or perhaps to me as well?  What would that be like?   These are all questions I’ve posed and the three of us have discussed. And here is where we stand.

F-buddies?
I only use this term because Kayla had used it to describe her relationship with her best friend and her best friend’s boyfriend. Kayla said that she does not want that for the three of us, that we mean so much more to her and that it is so much deeper than just a physical interaction. She talked of saying she would end the sex with her best friend if we all pursued a relationship. She even used the term, “I love you guys.”   And of course, we love her, she knows that, and we said so.   While that could be a good thing, to me, it is part of my struggle.   The situation could set her up for disappointment or hurt later on. I can only imagine what being “the third wheel” could be like and beyond disappointment and hurt, it could build resentment on her part.   Bottom line, it could turn our great relationship into an unhealthy one for her. That has implications for all of us.

And, just what kind of relationship would this be?   I guess it could be called poly, which I’ve never really considered. I have no qualms with that term, but, is that what this would be? Kayla uses the term “relationship” so there seems to be a certain level to commitment she is willing to make, but are we?

Her as a submissive?
When I think about this I actually feel two feelings that rarely surface in me. I feel a level of resentment with a dash of jealousy.   I am not a jealous person by nature, it is very un-me! I don’t like it. Here’s what’s going through my mind.

Waves of Resentment.

• I work hard on my submissiveness, she may not take it as seriously as I do. She may not be committed to it as I am. She may look at it as simply a game.   I resent all of that.
• What rules would she have? Same as me? Different? If different, are they less/more restrictive than mine? If she can do something without punishment but I can’t, well, that’s just messed up. Who does she think she is? I resent that.
• Would she also be accountable to me? I like that, but we would have figure out how that works as ultimately I do want Mike to be the ultimate authority figure and I want to be fair with Kayla. However, I like the idea that there is something to remind Kayla that despite her participation, she is not my peer. If she thinks of me as a peer, I resent that!
• Her level of commitment could never be consistent just due to lifestyle. She lives with her mom and goes to school. What, she comes over now and then when she chooses?   It makes it seem more like a game for her and not a lifestyle. Again, I take my commitment seriously and she will just be unable to do the same, even if she wanted to. I resent that!

Add in some Guilt.
Then I begin feeling guilty. Why wasn’t my first response to Kayla not one of compassion but instead a series of assessments as to her “fitness” to be with us?  See, the resentment is already manifesting itself in unhealthy ways as it poisons my empathy and compassion.

I shared just about everything I’ve written here with her, and of course, it did make her sad and she cried.  Not a full on cry, but teary eyed and emotional.  I know it wasn’t just in what I said, but in the manner in which I said it.  I know my tone was somewhat biting.  I apologized for my tone and tried to explain that it is not about a deficiency in her, it is about the realities of where she is at in life compared to ours and that despite our mutual love and respect, it just may be incompatible to the type of relationship we are considering.

All of my concerns are just as much about my own baggage and needs as it is about hers.   Ug, that sounded a bit like, “it’s not you, it’s me.”   But I want her to know I don’t see her as unworthy.

Dash of Insecurity?
I also have concerns about priorities. Will Kayla be a high enough priority for Mike and I that we do right by her, and will we be a high enough priority that she does right by us?  In other words, do we end up just considering each other as “available options” or is the relationship to be more meaningful than that. Not that whatever we have can’t be casual if that is what we decide, or that it can’t be more meaningful if that is what we decide, but each route has implications.

We all are works in progress to some degree, but Kayla, given her age and background is just more so.  I also am aware that whatever issues a person has they bring to any relationship. That’s a given and by itself not necessarily a problem.  But it can become one if that person is not willing to work on their own issues or allow help from their partners.   So far Kayla has impressed me with her own self-awareness of her needs, her strengths, and her weaknesses.  Including her willingness to seek advice and guidance and be open to constructive feedback.  That’s a plus, but apparently not enough to eliminate my concerns.

While I have been very impressed with Kayla’s reaction and responses, it has not lessened my anxiety about all these things. Yes, she has some needs, but don’t we all. She’s loving, caring, and self-aware, has some abandonment type issues with her parents but recognizes that and does not shy away from it. I can see that this could be fun and could be meaningful. But, my life is so good right now, and has already moved pretty fast in just the last 18 months. None of the positives I see with Kayla are enough to reduce my anxiety, resentment, and jealously, nor reduce my guilt for feeling anxious, resentment, and jealous.  And then we have the concerns I first expressed in my other posts.  Concerns about complicating my life and the fact Kayla is someone special to my son.

All these bad feelings.
 Sum it all up and another significant roadblock is whether or not we could ever have an arrangement where I don’t feel these negative feelings.  I don’t want to feel these things but that doesn’t change the fact that right now I do.  I know these feeling would end up manifesting themselves in various unhealthy ways. Unhealthy for me, my relationship with Mike, and for Kayla.   If I can’t get past these feelings, we just can’t move forward.

Mike and Kayla both seem to be outpacing me on this issue. While they are not dismissive of my concerns, they feel more carefree about just diving in, living life, and what happens will happen. I have reiterated with Mike that I stand by my commitments to him and will abide by anything he decides.

Where we are today
Mike said we should having a “cooling off” period so we all can reflect and continue to discuss our feelings.  That makes me happy and does reduce my anxiety a bit.  Mike set a date of November 15, where he said no decisions should be made before then. We’ll reassess on that date and he may decide we continue to wait or not, assuming Kayla is aboard with what he decides – which apparently she is.

One question I posed to Kayla that she has not been able to fully articulate is how she sees this dynamic working in her mind. What does she see as the ideal situation for her?   She has shared bits and pieces but hasn’t thought it through enough, so I am hopeful some additional time will allow her to understand and share her own needs and expectations better.   I hope that for myself as well.

Next:  80.  Breakthrough.  What a Week!